Yankee Jeter Fans
From the NY Post:
February 16, 2008 — How’s this for junk science - even with three Gold Gloves, Yankees captain Derek Jeter has been labeled the worst fielding shortstop in baseball.
But the numbers prove it, researchers at the University of Pennsylvania said yesterday at a meeting of the American Association for the Advancement of Science, in (of course) Boston.
Using a complex statistical method, researchers concluded that Alex Rodriguez was one of the best shortstops in the game when he played for the Texas Rangers.
When Rodriguez became a Yankee in 2004, he moved to third base while Jeter stayed at short.
But that may have been a mistake, said Penn researcher Shane Jensen.
Researchers looked at every ball put in play from 2002 through 2005 and recorded where the shots went.
Jensen said a player’s success depended on his range as well as how ef fectively he made decisions and posi tioned himself on the field.
Players were then ranked in each position from best to worst, with Mr. New York Baseball - Jeter - coming in dead last among major league shortstops during the research period.
A-Rod, who won two Gold Gloves at short, was ranked No. 2.
“The Yankees have one of the best defensive short stops playing out of position in deference to one of the worst defensive shortstops,” said Jensen.
But New Yorkers scoffed at the notion.
“I don’t know what they’re smoking down at Penn,” said Yankees fan Mike Birch, 32. “That’s preposterous. I completely disagree. Jeter’s a clutch player.”
“It’s ridiculous,” said fan Jay Ricker, 22. “Jeter is all-around awesome. He’s better than A-Rod any day. Character has a lot to do with it. He’s out there for his teammates, not just himself. He does it for the good of the team. That’s the kind of guy you want on the field.”
Ricker added that “A-Rod’s only out for the money. For him it’s not about baseball, it’s just about banking.”
Fans said Jeter’s greatness goes beyond the numbers he produces on the field.
“He has intangible qualities that can’t be measured with statistics,” said East Village bar owner Kevin Hooshangi, 28.
“He’s he ultimate teammate. It doesn’t matter what his percentages are when he’s making big plays in big games. He’s the one with four World Series rings.”
“I would disagree [with the study] of course, Jeter does a good job,” said Pam Lips, 28. “Rodriguez is OK but I would take Jeter over A-Rod.”
However, Frank Angelo, 50, gave A-Rod his due. “He’s the best shortstop in the American League playing third base,” Angelo said.
But Jeter as one of the worst?
“That’s not true,” Angelo said. “He’s a good fielding shortstop.” He even said he would keep Jeter at short. “Jeter’s the captain, he was there before A-Rod,” said Angelo.
To crunch the numbers, Jensen said balls put into play were divided into three categories:
The ability to field fly balls accounted for 33 percent, while line drives made up 25 percent, and ground balls made up 42 percent of the calculations.
Based on the studies, Clint Barmes of the Colorado Rockies was the best fielding shortstop in the game in that time period.
Jason Bartlett - recently traded from Minnesota to Tampa Bay, was third after A-Rod.
But as Yankee fan Brittnay Thompson, 32, said, it’s about who’s good in May, and who’s good in October.
“In big situations A-Rod drops the ball, no pun intended,” said Thompson.”
Reading these quotes by fellow Yankee fans is very frustrating. What difference does it make that Jeter is “clutch” and has “intangible” qualities? The report is about his defensive flaws, not his timely hitting. The entire article actually makes me laugh (the reporter is clearly biased). Who cares if A-Rod is “all about the money”? Again, what difference does this make? This doesn’t nullify the study’s content, nor does it make Jeter a better SS than Rodriguez.
If you’d like to read more about the method used and the actual logistics behind the abovementioned study, click here. But, to be honest, you don’t need stats or this study in order to know how bad Derek Jeter is in the field (even though there have been countless analyses before this one that label Jeter as a poor defensive infielder). Just watch the games and you’ll see balls pass Jeter left and right. His range (to left) is very limited, and you can see it in his play. Granted, his offense is great, so we can at least value that.
Often times, it’s fairly evident that Yankee fans are completely enamored by Jeter’s past achievements and forget about reality (the tangibles). The man cannot play very well at SS. He’s done some very memorable things in that position, but at the same time, we must be realistic when we think about Jeter’s defensive play (overall) especially when it effects the team’s ability to win or prohibit other teams from scoring runs. Jeter is getting worse and he cannot play the position well enough to justify finishing his career there.
(Thanks to Was Watching.)
February 17, 2008, 7:10 am at 7:10 am
C-
Great post.
Jason @ My Baseball Bias has talked aboit Jeet’s D before and I asked him these 2 question- If Jeter’s D is so bad, why do coaches and mgrs keep voting him best defensive SS?
I understand that the Gold Glove is nothing but a popularity contest, and accounts for O as well as D, but AL managers voted DJ top defensive SS in the AL this offseason!
Second, assuming his D is that bad, what do you propose we do? Second and third are spoken for, first will be once we sign Tex, we have 2 left fielders, where do you put him?
B
February 17, 2008, 2:54 pm at 2:54 pm
That’s the thing. In a few years, maybe when Damon is gone, you can have Jeter in the OF (RF maybe?). Or, in a few years, you could have Jeter as DH. Next year, once the Yanks sign Teixeira, you’ll probably have Matsui at DH, and Damon in LF, but depending on how Abreu does this year, Jeter at RF isn’t a bad idea (although it sounds really wierd).
I think Jeter has made some of the most memorable plays ever at SS, which is why managers vote for him (and he plays hard, everyday). And, in reality, yes, GG is all popularity based (and offensively judged), which explains why people like Rafael Palmeiro have won the award (at 1B) when he only played 28 games there that entire year (in 99). It’s telling because that was Palmeiro’s best offensive year as well.
February 20, 2008, 6:15 pm at 6:15 pm
There is no bigger liar than raw defensive stats. At the highest level there are only so many balls in play, so a popup to the catcher has to hurt all oither fielders. Even adjusted, or attempting to rate balls in play- this makes no sense. How do you detgermine a playable ball? What visual metrol,ogy did you use? Is everybody making the observation equally correlated in how they report the results? Are the results such as they are truly significant- it takes a ton of binomial data to be relevant at 95% confidence. Nobody who does this kind of thing actually does it in a rigorous manner. It is pseudo mathematics, the worst kind.
February 23, 2008, 5:34 am at 5:34 am
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